rnmcd Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 I am giving some thought to adding a Shout Box or an IRC to my site? All other things being equal (e.g., number of users, number/length of messages), does a Shout Box use more or less resources than an IRC? Does the TCH staff know of any TCH hosted sites (besides TCH itself) that is using a Shout Box or an IRC? You don't have to disclose the URLs. The reason I ask about TCH sites using a Shout Box or an IRC is I am wondering if these programs use too much of the TCH servers CPU resources. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TCH-Thomas Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 IRC would not be allowed per the AUP: Internet Relay Chat You may not use IRC scripts or programs that interfere with or deny service to other users on any other server, host, network or channel I would google for shoutbox or check out hotscripts.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeren Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 Well, from my personal experience, shout boxes will typically just be an iframe to display data and a small form that updates that iframe and the database. If you put an IRC applet on your site, depending on the one you use (with PJIRC seeming to be a favorite), then it's really up to what you want. Shout boxes will act like a message board thread. Using an IRC client would allow for instant chatting with your site members (though Java can sometimes be a pain). Resources wise, I believe the shout box would use less initially. Of course, if it's widely used, then you're looking at numerous database calls, updates, and page reloads. Using a Java IRC client would just require the user to download and activate it. Once it's up, any communication between the user and the IRC server of your choice is not through your site, so your bandwidth won't suffer from it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeren Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 (edited) And just to clarify (and mention what Thomas stated), since I believe this has been brought up before, it wouldn't be wrong to allow for a chat client on the server. As stated above, it won't use your system resources nor is it running an IRC service on TCH space. Having the client wouldn't be an AUP violation. Hosting your own IRC service/daemon would be, though. Edited March 6, 2007 by Jeren Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rnmcd Posted March 6, 2007 Author Share Posted March 6, 2007 IRC would not be allowed per the AUP: Is that a blanket restriction prohibiting IRC or it only restricting IRC that intentionally interferes with or denies service to other users on any other server, host, network or channel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeren Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 Is that a blanket restriction prohibiting IRC or it only restricting IRC that intentionally interferes with or denies service to other users on any other server, host, network or channel? From my understanding, it is a prohibition of hosting and running your own IRC server. Including a browser chat client that doesn't operate through their server would probably be acceptable. This means that you'd be looking to use a Java/Flash based set up over a CGI one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rnmcd Posted March 6, 2007 Author Share Posted March 6, 2007 And just to clarify (and mention what Thomas stated), since I believe this has been brought up before, it wouldn't be wrong to allow for a chat client on the server. As stated above, it won't use your system resources nor is it running an IRC service on TCH space. Having the client wouldn't be an AUP violation. I must be misinterpreting something. I think think the AUP does say that IRC is prohibited if used maliciously. My mistake also may be that this may not be IRC: http://www.tufat.com/script2.htm Do you think it is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeren Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 I must be misinterpreting something. I think think the AUP does say that IRC is prohibited if used maliciously. I know it isn't saying all IRC items are prohibited. I still believe it just means you installing and running your own server on their machines, especially attempting to do so on a shared hosting account. Hopefully some TCH person can hop in and confirm that. My mistake also may be that this may not be IRC: http://www.tufat.com/script2.htm Do you think it is? I didn't see any reference to IRC with that, so no, I don't believe it is IRC related. I think it just handles all communication locally, storing the chat information in a database. I don't know how system resources would be affected by this system, so again, perhaps a TCH-er could check this out and give you a better answer. For me, personally, I consider if what I'm about to use is a system resource hog or not. I believe that is what they might check for as well. But we'll see what they say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TCH-Bruce Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 I believe the flash chat you reference above would be acceptable to install. However if it starts eating up resources you could have your site suspended. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rnmcd Posted March 6, 2007 Author Share Posted March 6, 2007 Who should I direct my question to for a definitive answer? I do believe TCH-Bruce does believe it would be acceptable but there is the 1% chance he might be wrong. Is there a way to see if my site is eating up resources prior to it being suspended? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TCH-Bruce Posted March 7, 2007 Share Posted March 7, 2007 I checked with the help desk and found out that many sites were suspended using this script do to the sites becoming compromised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samrc Posted March 7, 2007 Share Posted March 7, 2007 (edited) I have a shout box on the home page of my TCH hosted site: samisite.com After looking into many available scripts, I chose to NOT use a script/database on my own site to create a shout box. Instead, an iframe pulls in a 3rd party blabber board. For years, I have paid $10 a year to zonkboard.com to host the board. If the form becomes a target for spam, is insecure, draws too many resources, my full site will not go down as nothing on TCH is at risk. The formatting of board perfectly fits the content of the site with full customization. Though there is additional cost in this option, in the long run, it provided a level of insulation from major problems that could not be found by running the same type script on my own site. Less upkeep. Less hassle. More safety. This friendly feature on the home page that invites visitors to say hi is quite popular and yet doesn't add potential threat to the site! Edited March 7, 2007 by Samrc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rnmcd Posted March 7, 2007 Author Share Posted March 7, 2007 When a site gets suspended, are the account holders allowed to FTP to their site so they can download the files/database or are they locked out permanently? Is running an IRC webchat on a forum (I'm not referring to running an IRC server) against the AUP? When I refer to an IRC webchat I am speaking of a Java applet that connects to an IRC server. Not MY(TCH) IRC server. It's one of the many public IRC servers out there like Sorcery that I've registered a channel on and point the webchat to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TCH-Bruce Posted March 7, 2007 Share Posted March 7, 2007 If your site is suspended you cannot access it at all until it is unsuspended. If it's a Java applet not connected to the TCH server sure since it won't be using your domains bandwidth or resources. From the Acceptable Use Policy You may not use IRC scripts or programs that interfere with or deny service to other users on any other server, host, network or channel IRC BOTS ARE PROHIBITED You may not engage in activities which harass other users. This includes, but is not limited to, "flooding" (rapidly entering text with the intent to disrupt service), "flashing" (disrupting terminal emulation), "takeovers" (improper seizing and abuse of operator privileges), attempting to send private messages to those who do not wish to receive them, attempting to return to a channel after being banned from it, and other disruptive behaviors. You may not attempt to impersonate other users. The use of nicknames does not constitute impersonation. You may run "clones" (multiple simultaneous IRC connections) and "robots" only as permitted by the host IRC server. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rnmcd Posted March 7, 2007 Author Share Posted March 7, 2007 I have a shout box on the home page of my TCH hosted site: samisite.com After looking into many available scripts, I chose to NOT use a script/database on my own site to create a shout box. Instead, an iframe pulls in a 3rd party blabber board. For years, I have paid $10 a year to zonkboard.com to host the board. If the form becomes a target for spam, is insecure, draws too many resources, my full site will not go down as nothing on TCH is at risk. The formatting of board perfectly fits the content of the site with full customization. Though there is additional cost in this option, in the long run, it provided a level of insulation from major problems that could not be found by running the same type script on my own site. Less upkeep. Less hassle. More safety. This friendly feature on the home page that invites visitors to say hi is quite popular and yet doesn't add potential threat to the site! Samrc, are you able to limit the use of your shout box to members of your forum? I'm afraid I'd get spammed like crazy if anyone could shout out a message. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rnmcd Posted March 7, 2007 Author Share Posted March 7, 2007 If it's a Java applet not connected to the TCH server sure since it won't be using your domains bandwidth or resources. From the Acceptable Use Policy So do you mean that if it is a java applet that IS connected to the TCH server it wouldn't be in violation of the AUP? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TCH-Bruce Posted March 7, 2007 Share Posted March 7, 2007 Please open a ticket with the help desk. The techs can give you a definitive answer on what you can or can't use on your site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samrc Posted March 7, 2007 Share Posted March 7, 2007 (edited) Samrc, are you able to limit the use of your shout box to members of your forum?I'm afraid I'd get spammed like crazy if anyone could shout out a message The SMF forum is an installed script running ON my own website at TCH. Posts can only be made by MEMBERS. The forum is new (January 2007). The shout box is on the right side of the home page and is open to ANYONE that visits the site, for any reason. There is no way to tie it to a member base. (Until January, I never considered having a member list!) I have had it up for years and rarely had problems with spam. I get an email notification when a post is made and I can see what URL they put in. If it is one I do not like I simply remove the post, but have only had to do that a handfull of times. Of course the service allows for banning users and IPS for up to 1000 days at a time if necessary but so far it has not been an issue. Truthfully, I expected more problems with this feature as I have seen many sites with trash in their shout boxes. That's part of the reason I went with a 3rd party service instead of installed script. If it became insecure, I did not want to have my whole site frozen. But my experience with it has been totally positive for years. Guess it depends on the type of site and the kind of visitor (mine are looking for help/assistance) and are not usually bored kids or people looking for free advertising. Edited March 7, 2007 by Samrc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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