Fonts

[natimage]

ok...this is probably very simple...but here goes!

 

I think this is a very old design issue, but I'm a new designer and just don't know the answers!

 

Is there a way to make sure that every user views my page with the fonts that I intend for them to be viewed with? Without putting all the text in graphic format?

 

Tracy

[TCH-JimE]

Hi,

 

There is, but as always there is problems.

 

I) Design using standard safe fonts. Using CSS its possiible to make a font list. The computer will check for each font as it goes through the list, the 1st font it comes across which matches it, it will use.

 

E.g. font-family: Arial, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif;

 

II) You can embed fonts which requires users to download the font to see it. Now this falls apart more then step one because its different depending on the browers.

 

Whatever happens, the user can override your fonts as a sercuity precaution.

 

I do and prefer step 1, makes it much easier!

 

Jim

[natimage]

Thanks, Jim.

 

I) Design using standard safe fonts. Using CSS its possiible to make a font list. The computer will check for each font as it goes through the list, the 1st font it comes across which matches it, it will use.

 

This actually explains a feature of CSS that I didn't understand. Never made sense to me that I could list all these fonts and only ever see one of them working!!

This sounds like a good enough solution for me. At least I can hopefully keep the text to a particular size so that it doesn't explode my whole table out of proportion!

 

On a side note...I got a new avatar! I think he's kind of cute. Looks kind of frustrated which is how I feel most of the time these days!!!

 

Have a good one!

Tracy

[surefire]

To add just a bit onto what Jim said...

 

If you're starting out with website design, I think every minute you spend learning the basics of CSS would be well worth it.

 

Example:

 

You can have CSS set certain fonts for all text inside of <p> tags... a different font for <h1> tags... and totally different fonts for all text inside of table cells.

 

The uses are almost limitless.

 

But here's the time-saver: If you set up your fonts in CSS and do it intelligently, then you can make a minor change to your CSS file and change the entire site instantly.

 

Another neat thing is to be able to bring your H1 fonts down to a more normal size... but still get the search engine benefits of using H1 tags in your pages.

 

CSS is pretty cool stuff... and just when you think you've got it mastered, you see someone else use it in a whole new way.

[SEO]

Dittos to what Jack is saying regarding css.

 

 

Another neat thing is to be able to bring your H1 fonts down to a more normal size... but still get the search engine benefits of using H1 tags in your pages.

Minor clarification:

 

Search engine algorithms do (actually I should say can) look at <H1> tags (header tags) but Google actually puts more weight on font size. Words with larger fonts obviously 'rank' higher than words with smaller fonts.

 

Just a little note

[surefire]

Question: Does Google know what size your h1 fonts are if you use an external style sheet?

 

I'd really like to know.

 

Not really my intention to make h1 smaller than anyother text... just reduced down from superhuge.

[natimage]

Great stuff...but why in the world does Google care what size fonts are on a page??? I am CERTAINLY not doubting you...but I did not know this and, without a deeper understanding, I guess it seems kind of silly to me. I will definately keep it in mind though!!

 

I understand most of the things mentioned about CSS. I am curious about how you define how the text should be written in a table cell. Do you just apply a font definition to the "td" tag using CSS?

 

I think we need a "Brain Overload" smilie!!!!

Tracy

[surefire]

Small example

td { text-align: left }

But you can also set up classes like

td.one { text-align: left }

 

And use it in your html as

 

<td class=one>

 

Lots of ways to do it. Don't limit yourself with these simple examples... tons of info on CSS right on the web.

 

Very useful stuff.

[TCH-JimE]

Hi,

 

Be wary using classes, you might find something you want to use later on, and want to change the class (you can create another one though)

 

Jim

[surefire]

Jim,

I didn't follow that one... could you help me understand what you mean?

Be wary using classes, you might find something you want to use later on, and want to change the class

Thanks

[SEO]

Question: Does Google know what size your h1 fonts are if you use an external style sheet?

I could have sworn that I addressed this last night... strange.

 

Good question and I do not have a definite answer, my first impression would be no. Let me look into it and I will give you an informed answer.

 

If I do not respond within the next couple of days... send me a PM.

 

 

why in the world does Google care what size fonts are on a page???

Think about... you are trying to define what is 'most' important on a page. What would you look at? Might you assume that a phrase or word in the largest font on a page have more importance? The author obviously wanted to put emphasis on it for some reason... sounds reasonable to me.

[KevinW]

I'll add my comments .. even if it is late in the day ...

 

Suggest you start by using your favorite search engine and look up 'web safe colors' or 'web safe fonts' or 'web safe font sizes'

 

People get these fabulous CDROM's with thousands of fonts, try to use them on web pages they are designing on their PC, and then when they publish their web pages up to their web site - the fonts and font sizes look different, the colors look different.

 

You need to learn that by default, fonts do NOT get loaded to a web provider. And that a visitor to your web site may see things completely different -- if they don't have those fonts either!

 

Take a look at all the well visited web sites --- if you notice they stick to the tried and true -- Arial, Verdana, etc.

 

Same thing with colors! Your monitor may be able to display 16 million shades of colors, but many web sites limit themselves to the 216 or so web safe colors!

 

-kw

[SEO]

Back to your question surefire:

 

Question: Does Google know what size your h1 fonts are if you use an external style sheet?

 

The answer is more complicated then I first relized. The first answer is I gave: 'NO' is correct (generally).

 

However, there is a small matter of spamming.

 

Remember that the original point of the heading tag was to convey information about the structure of the document. Important section headings should use a heading tag; it sets it apart from the rest of the text. What is being used now are multiple <h1> tags within the document that are altered via CSS to mimic the rest of the text - clearly spamming.

 

Therefore, it is believed that algorithms may search for such tactics for the purpose of penalty. Therefore, the answer may be 'Yes'.

 

The bottom line, formatting any tag to the extent that it no longer visually differs from normal text would be considered spamming and should be avoided. However, altering 'super big' to 'reasonably big' would not generate a red flag.

 

Hope this clarifies.

[TCH-JimE]

Surefire,

 

You could have:

 

table.class1 as one css which you start to use for all tables. Then you suddenly realise that you want some tables to be displayed differently, so it means correctiong the HTML and making a new class.

 

Sorry for the confusion!

 

Jim